Global or Globull warming?

This topic contains 187 replies, has 15 voices, and was last updated by Profile photo of t8 t8 1 month, 1 week ago.

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  • #187885
    Profile photo of Stu Stu 
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    On an related unrelated topic, it is a bit unnerving to see one's own country obliterated by little epicentre dots (look to the right of Australia to not find New Zealand):

    Stuart

    #187889
    Profile photo of david david 
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    Whats funny is the Global warming wackos acually claim that these cold spells and record breaking cold temperatures are part of the Global warming trend.

    –A wacko.

    Since you seem to think locally, perhaps climate change is more understandable for you than “global warming.”

    If you fill a glass up with ice so that it is overflowing, and then heated the glass up (global warming) the ice would overflow down the side of the glass. Any little people living near the bottom of that glass would experience cold water, and colder temperatures, despite the fact that the glass as a whole is warming up.

    The point is that warmer temperatures on a global scale do not mean uniform warmer temperatures for everyone.

    You should watch a Nova special. Or maybe a national geographic special.

    Do not confuse local weather with climate.

    Global warming means the global average temperature is increasing, this doesn't necessarily mean that the temperatures at all places around the globe increase at all times, merely that the average does.

    And it should be stupidly easy to check the math on whether the global average temperature is increasing.

    #187906
    Profile photo of karmarie karmarie 
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    Stuart, You'l notice the big earthquakes used to occur more at sea, where lately its been populated places. Thats what the difference has been.

    #187912
    Profile photo of WhatIsTrue WhatIsTrue 
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    David wrote:

    Quote
    And it should be stupidly easy to check the math on whether the global average temperature is increasing.

    I don't think anything about the earth's climate is “stupidly easy”, including predicting long term trends.  Check out the source of the above chart.  While these guys agree that man is affecting the earth's climate (potentially making things warmer in the near term) they are predicting a return to an ice age – perhaps a “great” one – by the end of the 21st century.

    I think that the cartoonish (and forged) “hockey stick” projections for earth's climate are a bit too “stupidly easy” to account for all of the various factors that produced the historical temperature trends depicted above.

    #187914
    Profile photo of WorshippingJesus WorshippingJesus 
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    Quote (david @ April 20 2010,03:43)

    Quote
    Whats funny is the Global warming wackos acually claim that these cold spells and record breaking cold temperatures are part of the Global warming trend.

    –A wacko.

    Since you seem to think locally, perhaps climate change is more understandable for you than “global warming.”

    If you fill a glass up with ice so that it is overflowing, and then heated the glass up (global warming) the ice would overflow down the side of the glass.  Any little people living near the bottom of that glass would experience cold water, and colder temperatures, despite the fact that the glass as a whole is warming up.

    The point is that warmer temperatures on a global scale do not mean uniform warmer temperatures for everyone.  

    You should watch a Nova special.  Or maybe a national geographic special.

    Do not confuse local weather with climate.  

    Global warming means the global average temperature is increasing, this doesn't necessarily mean that the temperatures at all places around the globe increase at all times, merely that the average does.

    And it should be stupidly easy to check the math on whether the global average temperature is increasing.


    David

    Your example of a glass is not a good one for if you heat up the glass no part of what is in the glass will get colder will it?

    Global warming is a big money scheme. All you have to do is follow the money to see that it is a false claim or at best over rated.

    Whos the Wacko now?

    WJ

    #187918
    Profile photo of seekingtruth seekingtruth 
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    Quote
    If you fill a glass up with ice so that it is overflowing, and then heated the glass up (global warming) the ice would overflow down the side of the glass.

    David,
    Actually ice is expanded taking up more volume so if you heap ice in a glass and warm it you end up with a less than full glass.

    My opinion is that it is much more hype than facts and for my part I believe most of it is a normal cycle, but it is politically expedient so it won't go away even if proved wrong (which according to some sources it has been).

    My opinion – Wm

    #187967
    Profile photo of t8 t8 
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    Hi seekingtruth.

    There in lies a dilemma. If icebergs are mostly below sea level with one-tenth of the volume above water, then when it melts due to warming, the amount of space decreases leading to a slight fall in sea level. Try a reverse experiment by filling up a bottle of water and putting it in a freezer.

    However, ice that sits on land, when it melts will contribute to a rise in sea level and a warmer temperature itself creates thermal expansion. i.e.,  its particles begin move to more which creates greater volume.

    Simplistically speaking you would expect that the first ice to melt would be ice shelfs and icebergs leading to an initial drop in sea level followed by land ice leading to an increase. However, I did see a doco once (but I wasn't paying too much attention) that said something like land ice is melting and forms a kind of river that flows under the ice shelf.

    However, if you measured all the ice that is not on land, including the Arctic, that would surely lead to a considerable drop if most of that ice was under the water. I don't know what the percentage of ice below the sea and above it is. It probably doesn't match the same proportion as icebergs.

    At least one credit climate scientists got was what they did after  Mount Pinatubo’s 1991 eruption. They entered the event into their climate models (well after the event), the models reported that Earth would have cooled by around 0.5°C a year or so later. The prediction matched cooling that had been observed around the globe after the eruption. Although you could argue that it is easy to make a prediction when you already know the answer, especially if you have the power to tweak the model.

    #187970
    Profile photo of t8 t8 
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    Quote (Stu @ April 20 2010,18:25)
    On an related unrelated topic, it is a bit unnerving to see one's own country obliterated by little epicentr


    I can't even see New Zealand, although Japan looks pretty serious. I think Japan is the most earthquake prone country.

    #187971
    Profile photo of t8 t8 
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    Western Australia had a 5.0 the other day. Certainly qualifies as a diverse place when it comes to earthquakes. The workers in two mines there got the day off.

    #188114
    Profile photo of Stu Stu 
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    Quote (WhatIsTrue @ April 21 2010,02:18)
    David wrote:

    Quote
    And it should be stupidly easy to check the math on whether the global average temperature is increasing.

    I don't think anything about the earth's climate is “stupidly easy”, including predicting long term trends.  Check out the source of the above chart.  While these guys agree that man is affecting the earth's climate (potentially making things warmer in the near term) they are predicting a return to an ice age – perhaps a “great” one – by the end of the 21st century.

    I think that the cartoonish (and forged) “hockey stick” projections for earth's climate are a bit too “stupidly easy” to account for all of the various factors that produced the historical temperature trends depicted above.


    What is “depicted above” is hilarious.

    Thanks for the laugh.

    Stuart

    #188115
    Profile photo of Stu Stu 
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    Quote (t8 @ April 21 2010,10:05)

    Quote (Stu @ April 20 2010,18:25)
    On an related unrelated topic, it is a bit unnerving to see one's own country obliterated by little epicentr


    I can't even see New Zealand, although Japan looks pretty serious. I think Japan is the most earthquake prone country.


    True! I hadn't spotted Japan. Because it is so spotted, I suppose.

    Stuart

    #188117
    Profile photo of Stu Stu 
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    Quote (t8 @ April 21 2010,10:10)
    Western Australia had a 5.0 the other day. Certainly qualifies as a diverse place when it comes to earthquakes. The workers in two mines there got the day off.


    I'm a bit surprised that a mag 5.0 quake would cause this kind of damage. We have a few that size each year in NZ with no reports of anything more than cans falling off supermarket shelves. Maybe we enjoy higher building standards without realising it.

    Stuart

    #188130
    Profile photo of WhatIsTrue WhatIsTrue 
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    Quote (Stu @ April 21 2010,16:20)

    Quote (WhatIsTrue @ April 21 2010,02:18)
    David wrote:

    Quote
    And it should be stupidly easy to check the math on whether the global average temperature is increasing.

    [Image removed – see previous post]

    I don't think anything about the earth's climate is “stupidly easy”, including predicting long term trends.  Check out the source of the above chart.  While these guys agree that man is affecting the earth's climate (potentially making things warmer in the near term) they are predicting a return to an ice age – perhaps a “great” one – by the end of the 21st century.

    I think that the cartoonish (and forged) “hockey stick” projections for earth's climate are a bit too “stupidly easy” to account for all of the various factors that produced the historical temperature trends depicted above.


    What is “depicted above” is hilarious.

    Thanks for the laugh.

    Stuart


    What exactly is the joke?  I'd like a good laugh too.

    #188300
    Profile photo of seekingtruth seekingtruth 
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    Wikipedia,
    Although the melting of the Antarctic ice sheet is widely believed to be associated with global warming, ice sheets on Antarctica have actually grown, rather than shrunk. Wingham et al. 20 showed “the Antarctic ice sheet growing at 5 ± 1 mm year-1 in period 1992–2003”.[7] Using satellite altimetry technique, authors show that “72% of the Antarctic ice sheet is gaining 27 ± 29 gigatons per year.”

    #188331
    Profile photo of Stu Stu 
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    Quote (seekingtruth @ April 22 2010,16:30)
    Wikipedia,
    Although the melting of the Antarctic ice sheet is widely believed to be associated with global warming, ice sheets on Antarctica have actually grown, rather than shrunk. Wingham et al. 20 showed “the Antarctic ice sheet growing at 5 ± 1 mm year-1 in period 1992–2003”.[7] Using satellite altimetry technique, authors show that “72% of the Antarctic ice sheet is gaining 27 ± 29 gigatons per year.”


    And who was widely believing this, and how is it relevant in your opinion?

    Stuart

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