Flat Earth?

This topic contains 2,434 replies, has 15 voices, and was last updated by  Dig4truth 5 hours, 10 minutes ago.

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  • #834694
     t8 
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    Earthshine

    The brightly lit portion of the moon is illuminated directly by the sun. The rest of the moon is still visible because of earthshine or sunshine reflecting off Earth.

    #834696
     t8 
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    ‘Joshua stopped the sun’ 3,224 years ago today, scientists say

    Researchers claim epic Biblical story is earliest account of annular eclipse that occurred on October 30, 1207 BCE; also helps pinpoint reigns of Pharaohs Ramesses and Merneptah.

     
    Cambridge researchers announced Monday that they have pinpointed the date of the biblical account of Joshua stopping the sun — which they claim is the day of the oldest eclipse ever recorded — to October 30, 1207 BCE, exactly 3,224 years ago.

    In a paper published in the “Royal Astronomical Society journal Astronomy & Geophysics,” researchers explained that they were consequently also able to refine the dates of the reigns of two Egyptian pharaohs of that era, Ramesses the Great and his son Merneptah.

    The paper reinforces research published earlier this year by Israeli scientists, which also interpreted the biblical story as referring to an eclipse on the same date.

    The researchers rejected earlier Chinese and Ugaritic records of eclipses as unreliable, concluding that the Bible contains the only record of a solar eclipse prior to 1000 BCE.

    Chapter 10 of the Book of Joshua relates that soon after Joshua and the Israelites entered the Promised Land, they waged battle against five armies which laid siege to the Gibeonites. Joshua had promised to protect the Gibeonites, so he led an army and defeated the five kings. Joshua prayed that God help the Israelites in their battle by stopping the sun:

    “Then Joshua spoke to the Lord on the day when the Lord delivered the Amorites before the children of Israel; and he said in the sight of Israel: ‘Sun, stand still [dom] upon Gibeon; and you, Moon, in the valley of Ayalon.’” (Joshua 10:12).

    “If these words are describing a real observation, then a major astronomical event was taking place — the question for us to figure out is what the text actually means,” said paper co-author Colin Humphreys from the University of Cambridge’s Department of Materials Science & Metallurgy.

    “Modern English translations, which follow the King James translation of 1611, usually interpret this text to mean that the sun and moon stopped moving,” Humphreys explained. “But going back to the original Hebrew text, we determined that an alternative meaning could be that the sun and moon just stopped doing what they normally do: they stopped shining.”

    Humphreys said that if the biblical account means that the light from the sun appeared to stop shining, it may refer to an eclipse.

    “This interpretation is supported by the fact that the Hebrew word translated ‘stand still’ has the same root as a Babylonian word used in ancient astronomical texts to describe eclipses,” he said.

    https://www.timesofisrael.com/3224-years-later-scientists-see-first-ever-recorded-eclipse-in-joshuas-battle/

    #834697
     t8 
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    Anyway, it saddens me to know that you post videos like the above, thinking you are poking fun at me.

    Mike, I try to be honest about stuff even if it might offend. That is truly how many see the Flat Earth argument. I am not joking about that. As for the indoctrination comment, that is the problem. You are like that guy who believes in the Trinity. You believe it so much that the guy that doesn’t believe it is indoctrinated. But the reality is the Earth as a globe has so much proof that saying those who believe the proof as being indoctrinated is really disingenuous.

    #834698
     t8 
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    Globe cannot be represented correctly on a flat plane

    I’m no rocket scientist, but I would have thought that your confusion is resulting from relying on 2D to fully explain 3D.

    I have also noticed other 2D reliance to explain 3D. While Globe Earthers (as you call them) often use 2D graphics, they do so to make something easier to understand. They are not really using 2D to prove the Earth as much as say Flat Earthers do to prove a Flat Earth.

    Same thing with that Alaska flight. The error is a globe earth being represented in 2D.

    Finally, the boat that is brought back from being over the horizon was never over the horizon in the first place. It was just too small to see.

    #834705
     Dig4truth 
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    I did watch the video with the hippie discussing the FE about a week or two ago. I too was impressed that he had most of the facts correct. This made me wonder if he isn’t a closet FE guy. I have watched several of his videos in the past and for the most part they are funny. But he nailed most of the facts in the FE video.

    As Mike pointed out the math he used is spot-on according to the scientists. So then where is the curve? Don’t you get tired of us pointing out the fact that the curve is missing and substantiating it with documented evidence? Maybe it’s just a blind spot out on the highly distorted waves of the water to you, I don’t know.

    I was impressed by Mike’s brief testimony. What an awesome God to reach down and rescue someone like me, I mean Mike. : )  I was a little curious as to why no one had commended him on this miracle of faith. Everything else aside, isn’t that what really matters? But not a word, just more pseudo science.

    I especially liked the way t8 went to the “pros” of science to remove any hint of a miracle from Joshua’s long day. I wonder if he buys into the humanistic explanations for the plagues of Egypt during the Exodus? Or a local flood instead of Noah’s flood? I mean why stop when you’re on a roll? Shoot, I bet Yeshua walking on water has a totally secular explanation.

    When science, falsely called, is your god then you must bow down to whatever it says.

    #834707
     t8 
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    Everything has an explanation whether it is natural or supernatural. Otherwise it didn’t happen right. Think about it.

    #834708
     t8 
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    Dig. You’re not thinking straight. If Joshua’s long day happened and there is physical evidence of such, then that is not against the event but for it. I’m surprised I need to point this out as it is common sense.

    #834709
     Dig4truth 
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    While I’m on the topic of choosing scientism over the Word of God, why not mull over this in depth video about the acuracy of the Scriptures.

     

     

    #834710
     t8 
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    “This interpretation is supported by the fact that the Hebrew word translated ‘stand still’ has the same root as a Babylonian word used in ancient astronomical texts to describe eclipses,” he said.

    Makes you think right? If not, then the real problem here is the lack of thinking right?

    #834711
     mikeboll64 
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    D4T:  I did watch the video with the hippie discussing the FE about a week or two ago. I too was impressed that he had most of the facts correct. This made me wonder if he isn’t a closet FE guy. I have watched several of his videos in the past and for the most part they are funny. But he nailed most of the facts in the FE video.

    He was spot on with his fake moon landing video, too.  So I’m also wondering the same thing about him being a closet flat earther.  Either way works, since the deceivers have been hiding the truth in plain sight for centuries.  If he’s not a closet flat earther, this would just be another example of that.

    D4T:  I was impressed by Mike’s brief testimony. What an awesome God to reach down and rescue someone like me, I mean Mike. : )

    You too, huh?  🙂  How great and awesome is our God?

    D4T:  I especially liked the way t8 went to the “pros” of science to remove any hint of a miracle from Joshua’s long day.

    More like amateurs.

    T8:  Dig. You’re not thinking straight. If Joshua’s long day happened and there is physical evidence of such, then that is not against the event but for it. I’m surprised I need to point this out as it is common sense.

    In what world does a solar eclipse cause the daylight to last longer?  I’m surprised I need to point this out as it is common sense, but Joshua wanted MORE daylight in order to continue defeating the enemy armies.  A solar eclipse SHORTENS the hours of daylight!  T8’s source says…

    “But going back to the original Hebrew text, we determined that an alternative meaning could be that the sun and moon just stopped doing what they normally do: they stopped shining.”

    Really?  Joshua wanted more daylight so “the nation could take vengeance upon its enemies”, and God acted on his command by making the sun and moon STOP shining?  Also, in what world has anyone ever seen a moon shining during the day of a solar eclipse?  So in his effort to “gather around him a great number of teachers to say what his itching ears want to hear” (2 Tim 4:3), T8 apparently lost track of his common sense.

     

    T8:  …the real problem here is the lack of thinking right?

    Yes… on your part.  Let us reason together starting from scripture, okay?

    Joshua 10

    12 At that time Joshua spoke to the LORD in the day when the LORD gave the Amorites over to the sons of Israel, and he said in the sight of Israel,

    “Sun, stand still at Gibeon,
    and moon, in the Valley of Aijalon.”

    So right away we see that the sun and moon were in different locations, right?  In order for it to be a solar eclipse (according to the helical model), the sun and moon must be in the SAME location as viewed from earth.  Which, btw, makes it impossible to see the moon shining, per your source.

    13a And the sun stood still, and the moon stopped, until the nation took vengeance on their enemies.

    Here we see that both the sun and the moon (in different locations) stopped until the nation took vengeance on their enemies.  Surely the idea isn’t that the sun and moon stopped in total eclipse position, making it dark until the nation took vengeance, right?

    13b The sun stopped in the midst of heaven and did not hurry to come in for about a whole day.

    And here we see that the sun STOPPED – IN THE MIDST OF HEAVEN.  How does an already stationary sun STOP in the midst of heaven, T8?  Surely a straightforward reading of the scripture conveys the idea that the sun, which normally moves across the heaven, stopped in its tracks and stayed there in the middle of the sky for about a whole day, right?  Same with the moon, right?  And surely the addition of the word “whole” conveys a 24 hour day, as opposed to the 12 normal hours of daylight, right?  Otherwise what would be the point?  (I guess Joshua might have given the command at noon or something, and the sun remained out another 12 hours instead of the normal 6 hours that would usually be left to the day.  But either way, a solar eclipse is out of the question.)

    Do you understand the question I keep asking you?  I realize you have a list of how it could mean this or it could be referring to that.  I’m asking you why it can’t mean that the sun, which normally moves across the sky, stopped in place for a whole day.

    Understand?  In other words, I don’t want your next comment to be: Well, it appears the solar eclipse thing doesn’t work… but maybe God stopped the earth from spinning.   Or:  Maybe the writer was just recording what he saw from his own perspective.

    Instead, I want an HONEST and DIRECT answer to WHY it CAN’T be EXACTLY as the scripture clearly describes it.

     

     

     

     

     

    #834712
     mikeboll64 
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    T8:  The brightly lit portion of the moon is illuminated directly by the sun. The rest of the moon is still visible because of earthshine or sunshine reflecting off Earth.

    Okay, that’s the “parroting what other people have told you” answer.  Have you looked into this earthshine claim?  I have.  Let me give you the short version…

    Notice it happens on a clear NIGHT with CRESCENT moons.  But does the diagram show the observer on the night part of the earth?  Nope.  You know why that and a dozen other diagrams of the same thing all show the observer on the day side of the earth?  Because that’s the only way they can sell the idea that sunlight is bouncing off the day side of the earth and reflecting back to the moon – which also has to be on the day side of the earth to catch the reflection.  Check it out for yourself.  Google “earthshine diagrams”.

    If you search long enough, you will eventually be able to find a couple that have the observer on the night side of the earth, like this one…

    But look at the impossible angles of the reflection.  How can light bounce off the front of the front ball and hit the back of the back ball?  Dude should have drew his reflection pattern like this…

     

    Also, remember that the first image (by a science teacher) says it only happens with CRESCENT moons.  That’s because anything from 1st quarter all the way to 3rd quarter requires the moon to even with or well beyond the day side of the earth…

    See what I mean?  Only waxing and waning crescents are in a position to capture sunlight reflected from the earth.  So what then do we make of this waxing gibbous earthshine I captured?

    Look again at the moon phase diagram.  Look at where a waxing gibbous moon is in relation to the earth and sun.  Now tell me how light from the sun could have reflected off the day side of the earth and hit the back side of this waxing gibbous moon.  And not only a tiny portion of the back side of the moon… but enough to light the entire half that is visible from earth.

    T8, you need to dig deeper.  Become more of an independent thinker/researcher and less of a person who just blindly parrots things he’s been told.  You know… more of the honest and open truth seeker you claim to be.  Oh, and remember that each one of these “proofs” I and D4T shoot down is one less in your bag of “overwhelming” heliocentric proofs.  That bag’s got to be feeling a little light these days, huh?  I think you’re down to:

    1.  I, T8, have personally verified with my own eyes that Antarctic is a continent.
    2.  I, T8, have personally verified with my own measurements all distances between land masses in the southern hemisphere.
    3.  I, T8, saw a light in the sky and have personally verified that it was a space craft travelling in the vacuum of space at 17,500 mph – in geosynchronous orbit around the earth.  Oh, and that it was in the thermosphere where it’s 4000 degrees, and that it’s made mostly of aluminum, which melts at 1600 degrees.

     

     

     

    #834720
     t8 
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    Earthshine claim? All objects reflect light. Even black objects reflect light even though they mostly absorb it. Otherwise you wouldn’t see them. BTW, the earth is not black, so it reflects light back onto the moon. Pretty obvious then that sunlight can light up the moon and the earth with reflected light from earth lighting up the part of the moon that the sun is not directly shining on. Look at the pic again and use your imagination. It is logical. Light travels round corners when it is reflected.

    And what do you mean by parroting? Obviously I do not work everything out on my own. Shocking I know. I don’t even own the videos I share. But this matters not to me because searching for truth means standing on other peoples shoulders. I guess everything you write was thought up by you and you alone. Congratulations on that. You are a better man than me in that respect.

    #834723
     t8 
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    Just put the Earth back about double the distance and there you have it.

    #834724
     t8 
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    Earthshine 101

    #834725
     t8 
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    Really?  Joshua wanted more daylight so “the nation could take vengeance upon its enemies”, and God acted on his command by making the sun and moon STOP shining?  Also, in what world has anyone ever seen a moon shining during the day of a solar eclipse?  So in his effort to “gather around him a great number of teachers to say what his itching ears want to hear” (2 Tim 4:3), T8 apparently lost track of his common sense.

     

    Mike, did you read my posts. I gave a number of views that could be possible. Eclipse is only one of them. Did I not also say that God who programmed the Matrix could alter our reality even time if he wanted. He is an unlimited God after all. Further, I believe that creation is the result of consciousness and because consciousness is perception, then God can freeze, alter, change his own physical laws whenever he wants. He is not subject to them himself right. He is not even bound by time. If so, surely he could even make one day have twice the time from our perspective if he so wished. That is, time from the perspective of Joshua and time from the perspective of the sun and earth movements could have been different than usual. I mean we even notice time going fast and dragging on from our own perspective too, but perhaps nothing like what Joshua asked for.

    So let’s go back to the original point which was that this text doesn’t say the Earth was flat. The End.

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