Death

This topic contains 232 replies, has 21 voices, and was last updated by  NickHassan 1 week, 1 day ago.

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  • #20253
     NickHassan 
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    Hi,
    Romans 6.7
    “for he who has died is freed from sin”
    The Jehovahs witnesses believe because of this verse all men are forgiven when they die!
    Does anyone else agree with this interpretation?

    #20300
     david 
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    “The wages sin pays is death.” (Rom. 6:23)

    The payment for sin is…..death.

    And the dead, “as for the dead, they are conscious of nothing at all, neither do they anymore have wages.” (Eccl. 9:5)

    Through death, they have paid for their sinful state. The wages sin pays is death.

    I believe Romans 6:7, literally says:
    'He who has died has been “justifed” from his sin.'
    [Lit., “has been justified.” Gr., de·di·kai´o·tai.]

    So what does this mean?

    “The wages sin pays is death.”
    If someone owes you a certain wage for a job which is stated as $100, and you get that $100, do you imagine there is more owing?

    #20321
     NickHassan 
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    Quote (david @ June 22 2006,07:27)
    “The wages sin pays is death.” (Rom. 6:23)

    The payment for sin is…..death.

    And the dead, “as for the dead, they are conscious of nothing at all, neither do they anymore have wages.” (Eccl. 9:5)

    Through death, they have paid for their sinful state.  The wages sin pays is death.

    I believe Romans 6:7, literally says:
    'He who has died has been “justifed” from his sin.'
    [Lit., “has been justified.” Gr., de·di·kai´o·tai.]

    So what does this mean?

    “The wages sin pays is death.”
    If someone owes you a certain wage for a job which is stated as $100, and you get that $100, do you imagine there is more owing?


    Hi david,
    Wow.
    So nothing has changed from Adam in the garden.

    “The wages of sin is death”

    That's all folks.

    So, according to david, there was no need for Jesus to come and give his life.

    There was the OT Law to find and follow if we wanted to avoid sin.
    There is no judgement.
    There is no condemnation for all men.
    Death is the end for sinners so eat drink and be merry because all you will face is the common fate of all men and animals and plants-death.
    So what if scripture says all have sinned-death is the only consequence for david.

    For him heaven awaits Jehovahs witnesses[the little flock]and some others enjoy a possible eternal life on earth. But these are bonuses for good behaviour.

    No wonder you have struggled with the idea of the second death, the lake of fire, into which are cast angels and men and death itself, the first death, that is your only wages.

    Read your bible again david and fear him who has the power to destroy the body and soul in the eternal lake of fire.

    #20340
     NickHassan 
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    Hi david,
    Is there two resurrections?
    If there is a second resurrection will all raised face judgement and possible condemnation?
    Or is Matthew 25 just a fable or an allegory?

    #20453
     NickHassan 
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    Hi david,
    Jn 3.16
    ” For God so loved the world that He sent His only begotten son that whoever believes in him should not perish, but have eternal life..”
    Jn 3.36
    'He who believe sin the Son has eternal life ; but he who does not obey the Son does not see life, but the wrath of God abides in him”

    There seems to be two choices here-eternal life in the Son or perishing under the wrath of God.
    Do you see this as just ordinary death with no further consequences for the disobedient?

    #21009
     NickHassan 
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    More for dunno

    #21014
     david 
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    Nick, I often get the feeling that you purposely say things that are wrong in an attempt to paint me in a bad light, when you know that what you are saying isn't true.
    Do you really think that there was no need for Jesus to come and give his life as a ransom sacrifice?
    I don't see how you could. Yet, you say this. “Wow” back at you.
    I say one thing. You jump to several wrong conclusions that you must know are wrong and state that this is what I believe.

    Why?

    Why do you do that?

    For what good noble purpose do you do that?

    #21015
     david 
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    Sorry, that third line should have said:
    Do you really think I believe that there was no need…..

    #21016
     NickHassan 
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    Quote (david @ June 29 2006,08:34)
    Nick, I often get the feeling that you purposely say things that are wrong in an attempt to paint me in a bad light, when you know that what you are saying isn't true.
    Do you really think that there was no need for Jesus to come and give his life as a ransom sacrifice?
    I don't see how you could.  Yet, you say this.  “Wow” back at you.
    I say one thing.  You jump to several wrong conclusions that you must know are wrong and state that this is what I believe.

    Why?

    Why do you do that?

    For what good noble purpose do you do that?


    Hi david,
    It is your false JW reasoning that leads me to propose that  conclusion;
    Because you say
    all are saved at death and
    thus there is no condemnation for any man
    so then surely there was no need for Jesus to come and die for us?[which proves the folly of the doctrine you teach]

    After men die, david, they all are eventually due to face the judgement seat of Jesus described in Matt 25[though in Jesus men can avoid it]

    You have yet to reply to the question about judgement.

    #23154
     NickHassan 
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    Hi ,
    There are of course two deaths.

    #25782
     NickHassan 
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    Hi david,
    You say
    “Nick, I often get the feeling that you purposely say things that are wrong in an attempt to paint me in a bad light, when you know that what you are saying isn't true.”

    No david we love our neighbours and hate to see them tangled in thornbushes of doctrinal folly.

    #32391
     NickHassan 
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    Hi,

    There is nothing like a brush with death to focus the mind.
    But then life itself is a terminal illness.

    #32393
     kenrch 
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    Quote (Nick Hassan @ Nov. 14 2006,01:16)
    Hi,

    There is nothing like a brush with death to focus the mind.
    But then life itself is a terminal illness.


    Honestly, while I wait to go to sleep. I don't think I'll miss this world.

    #32399
     t8 
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    If we were transported into Heaven and in God's presence, it would be difficult to want to come back to this world.

    #32403
     seekingtruth 
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    Paul had his vision so fixed on heaven that he was torn between leaving or staying and it was his love for others that was the only thing that really had any hold on him here.

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